There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

[backfootpunch]

Does it really matter if a Captain is going to use him as a bowler if needed though? I genuinely do not understand why this is an issue with his selection, if anything having a top order bat who can bowl reasonable spin will be a huge positive to take the pressure of the new players coming into the side.

There seem to be a host of people saying we shouldn't be playing 6 bowlers, but why does it matter if they are good enough to get in as batsmen in the first place. Ali averaged over 40 this year, scored more tons that Root and Cook I think, how can anyone argue he's not good enough to be in the side as a batsman.

Judging by how the spinners were used in India, I wouldn't say that it is clear if Ali is the first choice spinner anymore.

because if we are going to use him as a bowler surely its better freeing up the spot that a 6th bowler would fill with another batsman rather than having a 6th bowler who isn't needed, under-bowled and almost ends up leaving us playing with 10 men.

If he's going to be batting in the top six, he's a batsman first and foremost. Whether or not he turns his a over is irrelevant to that.

I genuinely do not understand why this is difficult to get. Root bowls spin and takes wickets, Jennings bowls decent seam, we don't consider that, so why shouldn't Ali be considered as a batsman?

Ali is the extra batsman, his bowling does not matter in that situation. Anderson, Broad, Woakes / Wood and Rashid are the bowlers. Cook, Jennings, Hameed, Root and Ali are the batsmen, Bairstow is the keeper and Stokes is the all rounder.

I give up, for love nor money can I see why that is a difficult concept to grasp or why it matters if Ali bowls. He's just scored 4 tons this year but we should dump him for another batsman simply because he can bowl off spin.

That makes no sense.

what makes no sense is picking a guy for the last 2 years as our first choice spinner and then just deciding he isn't a bowler any more

and btw i haven't said we should dump him, i said if he is going to play then pick an extra batsman rather than have ali, stokes, root and 4 specialist bowlers, so please dont try and imply something i didn't say

Moeen was always a stop gap as a spinner

He was only in the side because we had nobody else so they just picked someone who could bat

If we find someone better he will no longer need to bowl very much but will still be in the side as a batsmen who bowls a bit

The real question is whether we have found a specialist spinner so we don't need the stop gap anymore and moeen can become what he should have been in the first place

A top 6 batter who bowls the occasional over when required

[alfie]

Does it really matter if a Captain is going to use him as a bowler if needed though? I genuinely do not understand why this is an issue with his selection, if anything having a top order bat who can bowl reasonable spin will be a huge positive to take the pressure of the new players coming into the side.

There seem to be a host of people saying we shouldn't be playing 6 bowlers, but why does it matter if they are good enough to get in as batsmen in the first place. Ali averaged over 40 this year, scored more tons that Root and Cook I think, how can anyone argue he's not good enough to be in the side as a batsman.

Judging by how the spinners were used in India, I wouldn't say that it is clear if Ali is the first choice spinner anymore.

because if we are going to use him as a bowler surely its better freeing up the spot that a 6th bowler would fill with another batsman rather than having a 6th bowler who isn't needed, under-bowled and almost ends up leaving us playing with 10 men.

If he's going to be batting in the top six, he's a batsman first and foremost. Whether or not he turns his a over is irrelevant to that.

I genuinely do not understand why this is difficult to get. Root bowls spin and takes wickets, Jennings bowls decent seam, we don't consider that, so why shouldn't Ali be considered as a batsman?

Ali is the extra batsman, his bowling does not matter in that situation. Anderson, Broad, Woakes / Wood and Rashid are the bowlers. Cook, Jennings, Hameed, Root and Ali are the batsmen, Bairstow is the keeper and Stokes is the all rounder.

I give up, for love nor money can I see why that is a difficult concept to grasp or why it matters if Ali bowls. He's just scored 4 tons this year but we should dump him for another batsman simply because he can bowl off spin.

That makes no sense.

what makes no sense is picking a guy for the last 2 years as our first choice spinner and then just deciding he isn't a bowler any more

and btw i haven't said we should dump him, i said if he is going to play then pick an extra batsman rather than have ali, stokes, root and 4 specialist bowlers, so please dont try and imply something i didn't say

Moeen was always a stop gap as a spinner

He was only in the side because we had nobody else so they just picked someone who could bat

If we find someone better he will no longer need to bowl very much but will still be in the side as a batsmen who bowls a bit

The real question is whether we have found a specialist spinner so we don't need the stop gap anymore and moeen can become what he should have been in the first place

A top 6 batter who bowls the occasional over when required

Well that is the question , isn't it ? I'm not convinced yet , despite some promising signs at times , that Rashid is that bowler.
I still expect them to start with Moeen as the spinner against SA ; not sure that will last all summer.

[Arthur Crabtree]

England will keep the same squad for a three ODI tour of WI in February for the most excruciatingly shoe-horned in extra series in history. Hales is unlikely to be fit.

[Arthur Crabtree]

With Buttler, Stokes and Woakes missing the ODIs v Ireland (which will be rained off) there must be places available, probably to be taken by existing squad players, but could go to newer players. Apparently Jordan won't be coming back. Either way there should be new or returning players in the squad. Assuming they don't rest anyone...

Hales/Roy/Root/Morgan/Billings/Bairstow/Moeen/Rashid/Willey/Plunkett/Ball
Finn/Duckett/S.Curran/Livingstone

Dawson/Broad/Bresnan/Ansari/Vince/C.Overton as long shots.

Wood still injured. Not sure about Topley.

[rich1uk]

i would like to see them maybe give sam curran a game, given he looks more a like for like replacement for stokes

morgan, roy and billings will obviously start given they have been asked to come back from the IPL for it so that probably rules out any chance of duckett getting a run

[Dr Cricket]

Duckett could still play if they don't replace stokes with an all rounder,

[rich1uk]

duckett would only play if they rest root i would think

[Dr Cricket]

duckett would only play if they rest root i would think

good point and not sure Root will play the ireland game, he probably would start in late may and not early may.
would be daft for ECB to make Root play the ireland game would mean constant cricket from may to next April.
Root should ideally miss the ireland odi and WI limited over series in September.

be interesting how they replace stokes, they haven't really got a ready made all rounder at 5, unless Ali gets promoted or they just bring in another batsman and have Ali, Rashid and 3 seam bowlers with no 6th bowling in the side.

With Stokes england been mostly playing 6 bowlers in T20 and Odi, can't see Sam Curran being good enough with the bat yet to have 6 bowlers in the side unless they trust Ali up the order again.

[rich1uk]

thats one of the possible issues with the side AC suggested above if they do rest root, there is no-one to backup the 5 main bowlers

none of hales, roy, billings, morgan and duckett can even give you an over or two if desperate, so if root is rested they need to think what they do about having a 6th option as going into an ODI, even a fairly meaningless one like Ireland, with just 5 bowling options is a risk

[andy]

Roy can bowl useful seam ups? Seen him bowl in past.. if desperate

[rich1uk]

interesting statements from Stewart, got to be honest i wouldn't be averse to seeing Bairstow play as a batsman only and have Foakes get the gloves

http://www.espncricinfo.com/county-cric ... 89991.html

[Arthur Crabtree]

I think I'd like Bairstow to be given a couple of years (as Prior was) to improve as a keeper, as he is probably going to be a 40+ averaging batter and having a keeper who is a genuine top order batter is a real strength. Though if he doesn't get better over this time period, it seems likely he won't ever be good enough with the gloves, so his keeping will remain a liability that needs to be repaired. It feels too early to abandon a selection that is at least partly working at the moment.

[rich1uk]

i know there is an element of if its not broken why fix it, i just cant ignore the difference in averages between playing as a batsman only, to playing as a keeper-batsman for the only guys who have done both for any meaningful length of time

bairstow might be the exception to the rule but history isn't on his side

[Arthur Crabtree]

After the winter tour, there is a position available.

This could be given to a number five, with Moeen going back to eight as the sole spinner.

A new spinner with Moeen staying at five.

Another keeper with Bairstow going to five and Moeen to eight.

Out of those scenarios, I prefer England to look for a spinner. Maintaining Moeen as the lead spinner and bringing in a new batter is my least preferred.

Ten probables:

Cook/Haseeb/Root/Jennings/Moeen/Stokes/Bairstow/Woakes/Someone/Broad/Anderson.

[rich1uk]

maybe semantics but not sure i would go as far as including Haseeb and Jennings as "probables" atm

they did enough over the winter to be at the front of the pack but there is alot of cricket to be played between now and the SA series and they will need to score runs to stay there

in a normal year where we are playing tests in May they would have been almost certain to play but with the extra couple of months there is time for them to lose their spots or others jump ahead of them