There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

[Arthur Crabtree]

I've only read the headline but that suggests Mike Selvey thinks the problem with Gooch as batting coach is that no one listens to him...

[alfie]

Very good young blogger talking a lot of sense

http://jacksheldon93.tumblr.com/post/71 ... -test-team

Yeah , thought that was all pretty reasonable. Probably too reasonable for those who like drama..

Liked his last point.

[sussexpob]

Very good young blogger talking a lot of sense

http://jacksheldon93.tumblr.com/post/71 ... -test-team

Yeah , thought that was all pretty reasonable. Probably too reasonable for those who like drama..

Liked his last point.

His last point summed up the article.... wishy washy. Not a lot suggested other than Status Quo, and not a lot of expanding as to why.

[Arthur Crabtree]

I've only read the headline but that suggests Mike Selvey thinks the problem with Gooch as batting coach is that no one listens to him...

It seems because he is too old.

I remember Boycott being sought as a freelance batting coach into late in life. I can't imagine age is a factor. Maybe just being there too long could be a factor.

[Arthur Crabtree]

His last point summed up the article.... wishy washy. Not a lot suggested other than Status Quo, and not a lot of expanding as to why.

I suppose the point is that radical changes aren't needed.

There are some who see this series in isolation, and some who see it as part of a two year decline. Even though I belong to the latter camp, I suspect it would be difficult to think of the Ashes as any other than the end of a cycle for the England team. It would have been difficult to make changes to coach/team before then. If we'd lost without say, Flower, Gooch, Swann, Trott and KP, changing the set up and being progressive would have been seen as part of the problem.

[alfie]

Not just his age , though , is it , Arthur ? Personality too , surely.

Not that I know he is the cause of all the batting woes. But certainly the younger bats generally don't seem to be improving under his tutelage , so it may be that he isn't getting through to them.

Perhaps a Collingwood ; who arguably had to work harder at his own game than Gooch , might be a good replacement ? If he wants to...I fancy he might relate more to the new generation.

Maybe.

[sussexpob]

Perhaps a Collingwood ; who arguably had to work harder at his own game than Gooch , might be a good replacement ? If he wants to...I fancy he might relate more to the new generation.

Maybe.

I dont understand why you or the article would mention Collingwood. Durham's batting line up is possibly the worst to ever win a Championship in terms of runs scored, Collingwood himself was a batter of restraint and mental toughness and not technique, and his stroke play was limited at best.

As for Thorpe... (a) Indicated earlier in the year he had no great desire to step up.... (b) Joe Root has worked with him closely and he looks lost at sea technically on this tour.

[Arthur Crabtree]

I was going on what Selvey was saying about age.

It's true that England have failed with the bat very badly in contrasting circumstances. UAE and Australia. In both cases, obviously they were on tour. And not only did they appear unprepared for the bowling they found, they were unable to adapt to the challenge. While you'd expect KP, Bell, and Cook to take responsibility for their own game, probably it is the coaches who should be exposing them to the kind of challenges peculiar to tours. The flat sliders they faced in UAE, the pace and hostility they faced in Australia.

[Arthur Crabtree]

My guess is that Colly will take a coaching job at county level and work to being England coach in the future. Giles taking over looks nailed on.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Unless Flower stays on.

[alfie]

OK , Sussex ...you are clearly unhappy with the batting coach , captain , selectors and pretty well anything else around the England set up ...which is your right.

But do you actually have any constructive ideas as to how things might be improved ? Happy to hear them...even if I don't think much of them I promise to debate in a civilized manner...

[alfie]

Unless Flower stays on.

Some suggestions that the way Flower spoke after Melbourne indicated he was keen to continue. I think that may be reading too much into it myself ; but it wouldn't shock me if he did.

And as I have said all along , I'd be happy enough if he did. I accept a lot of other people wouldn't be...

[Arthur Crabtree]

Is Colly Durham's batting coach by the way?

Has Root been lost technically? Criticisms were made of his front foot play in England, but he's principally got out chasing wide balls in this series. I don't think he's been technically hapless. Though it is said Thorpe won't tour, so that's that.

[alfie]

Perhaps a Collingwood ; who arguably had to work harder at his own game than Gooch , might be a good replacement ? If he wants to...I fancy he might relate more to the new generation.

Maybe.

I dont understand why you or the article would mention Collingwood. Durham's batting line up is possibly the worst to ever win a Championship in terms of runs scored, Collingwood himself was a batter of restraint and mental toughness and not technique, and his stroke play was limited at best.

As for Thorpe... (a) Indicated earlier in the year he had no great desire to step up.... (b) Joe Root has worked with him closely and he looks lost at sea technically on this tour.

Collingwood was mentioned - by me at least - as just one possibility . His own limited stroke play doesn't automatically mean he would be a poor coach though. You can understand - and teach - the theory without being brilliant at executing it yourself , surely ? And certainly a bit of restraint and mental toughness would be handy traits to pass on to the current players...

[Arthur Crabtree]

Yet Flower in the summer seemed to suggest he'd be moving on after the winter. My feeling is that Flower deserves a chance to rebuild the team, though Sussex's criticisms are fair (listening out to commentators since it was discussed on here, most of them seem to think/assume Flower isn't in charge of tour selection) . I can't know enough about individual coaches like Gooch. I suspect only people within the set up can judge that.