There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

[Durhamfootman]

If only there was a young spin bowling all rounder out there...

its a shame that both borthwick and rashid play for counties whos pitches are generally made for seam bowlers and are in the teams as batsmen and partnership breakers, if they want to get better as bowlers they need to move counties and play there games on pitches that offer more for spin bowling where they would hopefully bowl more overs and gain much more confidence

easy to say that, but when your county keeps winning the CC and you get a fair old slice of that half mill, why would you move?

Going back to the 70's and 80's, Headingley seemed to be a turner, if the dvd is anything to go by. DL would know better than me

[andy]

Borthwick will keep getting better and better IMO 2 or 3 years time he will be England's spinner, possibly batting 7 allowing us 4 quicks...until then Monty has to be the man.

[Durhamfootman]

Durhamfootman ------ I can assure you it's not just you !!!!! My captain for many of my club games was a man who believed that when you changed the bowling you CHANGED MORE THAN JUST THE BOWLER otherwise it wasn't worth it. He always wanted one bowler who was the quickest he could get , one swing bowler , one seam bowler and two spinners which was generally one off spinner and one slow left arm. One or more of those five were allrounders. He won more dames than he lost because the batsmen generally knew that 180 to 200 was going to be enough.

Never worked for Steve Waugh..... and he had arguably the best dual spinner combo ever

if you mean Warne and the other one (who name eludes me for the moment) then they were both leggies. my point, and bondy sees it the same way, judging by his post, is having 2 spinners who turn the ball both ways

Neither of the spinners has to be an allrounder (in the way that Blackwell, say, was an all rounder) if...... IF..... the no.6 IS a genuine all rounder.

I'm not suggesting that Stokes is that no.6, merely postulating what might be possible if he does turn out to be. Nor am I pushing Borthwick forward as one half of a pair of spin twins. Anyone who knows me, knows that I'd much rather they were both winning the CC for Durham

what was that Oz leggies blasted name?

my memory is shocking atm

[D/L]

No wicket is anything other than the groundsman intends it to be, unless he gets it wrong, DF.

Like all others, the Headingley wicket is prepared with the strengths and the weaknesses of both teams in mind. Generally, over the decades, with a few exceptions in the years of the Verity era, it has favoured seam more than spin.

[D/L]

...what was that Oz leggies blasted name?

my memory is shocking atm

McGill?

[Durhamfootman]

and Durham won the 2009 CC with 2 spinners in the side for much of the campaign, so the idea that the riverside won't take spin is a bit off the mark, tbh. the riverside pitch is generally quite helpful to spinners, it's just that the overheads in April May and Sept usually mean that the quicks get the job done too quickly for the spinners to get a go.

blame the ECB for insisting that Durham play 11 of their CC matches in those silly 3 months................ but that's another point, for another thread...... the 'Something has to be done, Schofield thread'

McGill! thanks DL. Good point about the pitch, btw.... blame the ECB for insisting on luke warm pitches for luke warm players

[Alviro Patterson]

If only there was a young spin bowling all rounder out there...

*cough* Azeem Rafiq *cough*

Future England captain *cough*

[Durhamfootman]

*cough* Moeen Ali *cough*

[Durhamfootman]

*cough* Moeen Ali *cough*

second spin option, obviously

[Alviro Patterson]

Cook, Root, Ali, Bell, Stokes, Ballance, Bairstow, Bresnan, Broad, Anderson, Panesar the way to go in 2014.

[Durhamfootman]

Cook, Root, Ali, Bell, Stokes, Ballance, Bairstow, Bresnan, Broad, Anderson, Panesar the way to go in 2014.

I'm losing faith in the idea of Root as an opener, tbh, and I am yet to be convinced by Bairstow. Anderson may well become a casualty of this series, given that he has had a very decent international career, and climbed suitably high up the list of leading England wicket-takers. He might well chuck it in and concentrate on trying to win Lancs another CC title. If I was trying to bed Ali and Stokes into the team, I wouldn't be dropping Pietersen any time soon....... although I would give him a *modded* good slap every day.

What I would be doing is stopping my coaches from trying to re-coach Finn, and I'd be telling him not to worry about breaking the stumps.....just to run in and bowl as fast as he can. 3 over spells like Johnno..... why not?

[Alviro Patterson]

Cook, Root, Ali, Bell, Stokes, Ballance, Bairstow, Bresnan, Broad, Anderson, Panesar the way to go in 2014.

I'm losing faith in the idea of Root as an opener, tbh, and I am yet to be convinced by Bairstow. Anderson may well become a casualty of this series, given that he has had a very decent international career, and climbed suitably high up the list of leading England wicket-takers. He might well chuck it in and concentrate on trying to win Lancs another CC title. If I was trying to bed Ali and Stokes into the team, I wouldn't be dropping Pietersen any time soon....... although I would give him a *modded* good slap every day.

What I would be doing is stopping my coaches from trying to re-coach Finn, and I'd be telling him not to worry about breaking the stumps.....just to run in and bowl as fast as he can. 3 over spells like Johnno..... why not?

There's very few credible long term alternatives for the opening slot so Root will have to do for now. Bairstow is rightfully owed a run in the England team after spending so much time on the sidelines, causing his development to stall.

Anderson isn't finished by a long shot and I reckon he's got the 2015 World Cup in his sights before any pending retirement, added to the fact England will only play two home test series in 2014.

Stokes, Ballance and Bairstow are very strong characters and don't need a show pony to mentor them. Moeen Ali is familar to being against the grain as he's played for Worcestershire for all that time.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Robson is a credible alternative opener.

Seems, in places, the Stokes backlash has begun. I think he's been impressive.

When we had Swann, we always played a spinner. He was a danger on all pitches, and he bowled a lot of overs. I can see us not always playing a specialist spinner now.

[KipperJohn]

I don't suppose Bell will ever rid himself of the 'silly shot' syndrome he has when his brain goes walkabout - but presuming if he stays in the squad it's absolutely imperative he bats at 3 - why there was a public debate about it I'll never know. KP Cook and Bell have to stay or we'll have no experience at all - not that you'd have noticed it much this series.

What also confounded me today was putting Bairstow up in front of the cameras - another appalling lack of judgement by whoever is in charge.

[Durhamfootman]

Robson is a credible alternative opener.

as is Compton, I suppose..... now that the other high maintenance guy is no longer in the side