There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Alviro Patterson » Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:41 pm

Durhamfootman wrote:positive note, at least. Stokes' knock ought to have secured him the number 6 slot for the rest of this tour. There are no tests between Sydney and the arrival of SL in May, so I imagine he will start at 6 next year and as long as he doesn't pick up an injury or completely screw it up, I'd imagine he will probably get the whole of the summer to nail the spot down, so at least that solves that problem for a while.

And of course his bowling means that his inclusion in the side, by default, also resolves the perennial 4 man/5 man debate, assuming they don't do anything stupid like bat him at 8 in a 4 man attack.


England finding a long term option for a number 6 bat and 4th seamer in Ben Stokes is a big positive, almost compensates for the current hammering down under.

Also a big positive from a Yorkshire perspective, means the ECB won't be helping themselves to Ballance and Bairstow as much and the White Rose County can go into the 2014 County Championship campaign virtually full strength :D
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby D/L » Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:42 pm

Durhamfootman wrote:positive note, at least. Stokes' knock ought to have secured him the number 6 slot for the rest of this tour. There are no tests between Sydney and the arrival of SL in May, so I imagine he will start at 6 next year and as long as he doesn't pick up an injury or completely screw it up, I'd imagine he will probably get the whole of the summer to nail the spot down, so at least that solves that problem for a while.

And of course his bowling means that his inclusion in the side, by default, also resolves the perennial 4 man/5 man debate, assuming they don't do anything stupid like bat him at 8 in a 4 man attack.

History may be against you there, DF, but I agree. However much ability Stokes turns out to have as a batsman, and his century in no way suggests a "flash in the pan", he has earned the right to a decent run in the team.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:58 pm

Alviro Patterson wrote:
Also a big positive from a Yorkshire perspective, means the ECB won't be helping themselves to Ballance and Bairstow as much and the White Rose County can go into the 2014 County Championship campaign virtually full strength :D


Bairstow has a chance of replacing Prior, if Matt has a poor summer. And having potentially sorted out the number six, there may be other middle order spots on the way.

Bairstow has disappeared from the limited overs scene though.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:00 pm

And Bresnan may retain his central contract.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Alviro Patterson » Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:33 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:
Alviro Patterson wrote:
Also a big positive from a Yorkshire perspective, means the ECB won't be helping themselves to Ballance and Bairstow as much and the White Rose County can go into the 2014 County Championship campaign virtually full strength :D


Bairstow has a chance of replacing Prior, if Matt has a poor summer. And having potentially sorted out the number six, there may be other middle order spots on the way.

Bairstow has disappeared from the limited overs scene though.


The keepers position may well be determined who how is the better gloveman as opposed to the run scorer, this puts Buttler into test contention if he has a decent season with Lancashire and with England in the limited overs internationals.

If Bairstow scores a shed load of runs for Yorkshire in the 1st 7 County Championship matches batting at 5, he would be wasted in Prior's position, as would Stokes.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:37 pm

I could see Buttler being a candidate, but I think the common view is that Buttler is a worse keeper currently than Bairstow, though Bairstow doesn't inspire confidence in many.

If Stokes is going to bowl a share of overs, I think he might be better batting at seven if we have a batter/keeper in the side.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:40 pm

Anyway we don't seem to be looking beyond Buttler and Bairstow, with Foakes longer term.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby SaintPowelly » Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:49 pm

If the keeper was selected on glovework, Bates would be 1st choice.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby DiligentDefence » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:37 pm

SaintPowelly wrote:If the keeper was selected on glovework, Bates would be 1st choice.

Selection on glovework hasn't happened for a long time Powelly.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby D/L » Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:23 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:I could see Buttler being a candidate, but I think the common view is that Buttler is a worse keeper currently than Bairstow, though Bairstow doesn't inspire confidence in many...

Surely, to be candidates, they only have to be better than Prior and able to bat a bit? There could be many of them.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Making_Splinters » Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:30 pm

D/L wrote:
Arthur Crabtree wrote:I could see Buttler being a candidate, but I think the common view is that Buttler is a worse keeper currently than Bairstow, though Bairstow doesn't inspire confidence in many...

Surely, to be candidates, they only have to be better than Prior and able to bat a bit? There could be many of them.


Neither Buttler nor Bairstow are obviously better keepers than Prior, equally neither of them have extended records to back up the notion that they are better batters either.

There are very few good keepers in this country, excluding the likes of Foster who're never going to be picked, you're pretty much left with the Hampshire's Bates.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby SaintPowelly » Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:44 am

I would recommend Wheater, his glovework is superb and batting can take a game away from anyone, unfortunately he seems to lack the common sense of when to reign it in abit.

If D/L is frustrated with how Prior bats, I don't think Wheater will calm him.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:48 am

I remember someone in the England camp saying England wouldn't pick a keeper who couldn't bat in the England top six, just on his batting.
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Wed Dec 18, 2013 2:03 am

There's quite a bit of annoying press about how England have to build up to the next Ashes series. Regardless of the short term contests, like India next summer.

We do seem to have arranged for ourselves an Ashes summer, Pakistan away and South Africa away in 2015 though!
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Re: There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

Postby Making_Splinters » Wed Dec 18, 2013 7:58 am

SaintPowelly wrote:I would recommend Wheater, his glovework is superb and batting can take a game away from anyone, unfortunately he seems to lack the common sense of when to reign it in abit.

If D/L is frustrated with how Prior bats, I don't think Wheater will calm him.


From what I saw of Wheater last season, I wouldn't describe his glovework as superb, though of course I have seen far less of him than Hampshire fans. While his batting is promising, I would not say, as of yet, that he has the maturity to be a consistant performer at domestic level, let alone at the highest level.

There will be a lot of eyes on Buttler following his move to Old Trafford: Can he bring his obvious talent to bear in the LVCC at the top division as a first choice keeper in all formats?
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