All time Test XI's

[Red Devil]

West Indies

1984 onwards

Greenidge
Haynes
Viv
Lara
Chanderpaul
Hooper (ok spinner)
Dujon
Marshall
Ambrose
Walsh
Garner

Not Walsh for me - great for longevity but just wasn't the same class as the others IMO. Holding was class and would be an auto pick for me and also Ian Bishop was blighted by injuries but I'd take a fully fit version ahead of Walsh

Richie Richardson for Hooper as well IMO - not sure Hooper's part time spin gets him in.

Fully agree with the rest

[Red Devil]

India

Gavaskar
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendulkar
Kolhi
Pant
Jadeja
Kapil
Ashwin
Shami/Bedi
Bumrah

Top 5 picks itself. Jaiswal might get in there one day if he carries on where he began. Sharma, Azaruddin (sp?) and Laxman are unlucky to miss out, but the competition is stiff.

Ashwin's record speaks for itself, India's best every spinner, no question (and he can bat). Bumrah likewise as a quick. Kapil is surely uncontroversial as India's best fast-bowling allrounder. Jadeja is hugely underrated as a bowler, but he's incredibly effective, especially in the subcontinent, and an all-rounder his record surpasses Kapil.

Pant is probably a controversial pick, but I rate him higher than Dhoni. Dhoni was a magnificent one day player, easily in the India all time ODI XI, but Pant's record with both bat and gloves is better in tests. I am aware I may be alone on this one...

That just leaves the last bowler, and I'd go with Shami if you want a quick, Bedi for a spinner, but you could make a case for B Kumar, Ishant or Zaheer among the quicks, and Kumble and probably several others who were before my time for spinners. Axar Patel and Kuldeep have both done well, but on a limited sample size.

Like this team. The only change i would have is I would play Kumble instead of Bedi. Rishabh is better choice imo than Dhoni. Dhoni after playing for more than a decade could not score even one ton in SENA country. Rishabh Pant already has two even though he hasn't even played half of what Dhoni played.

Rishabh: 20 Test in SENA Avg: 40.61 and 4 tons
Dhoni: 32 tests in SENA. Avg: 31.47 and no ton

Tight between Bedi and Kumble, but agree on everything else

[Gingerfinch]

West Indies

1984 onwards

Greenidge
Haynes
Viv
Lara
Chanderpaul
Hooper (ok spinner)
Dujon
Marshall
Ambrose
Walsh
Garner

Not Walsh for me - great for longevity but just wasn't the same class as the others IMO. Holding was class and would be an auto pick for me and also Ian Bishop was blighted by injuries but I'd take a fully fit version ahead of Walsh

Richie Richardson for Hooper as well IMO - not sure Hooper's part time spin gets him in.

Fully agree with the rest

But of we're taking it from 1984, Holding was way past his best. Fair enough on Richie, he was a fine player and a better bat than Hooper.

[alfie]

West Indies

1984 onwards

Greenidge
Haynes
Viv
Lara
Chanderpaul
Hooper (ok spinner)
Dujon
Marshall
Ambrose
Walsh
Garner

Not Walsh for me - great for longevity but just wasn't the same class as the others IMO. Holding was class and would be an auto pick for me and also Ian Bishop was blighted by injuries but I'd take a fully fit version ahead of Walsh

Richie Richardson for Hooper as well IMO - not sure Hooper's part time spin gets him in.

Fully agree with the rest

Agree with Red here. Holding has to be in ; and Hooper with a modest batting average of 36 and bowling of about 50 doesn't cut it for me. Let Viv bowl some of his part time spin if those fast bowlers actually need any help

[Gingerfinch]

Was the Holding of 1984 better than Walsh of say the 90's? Not for me.

[alfie]

Was the Holding of 1984 better than Walsh of say the 90's? Not for me.

Ah. I wasn't factoring in the "1984" bit ... I see what you mean. Would probably have to go back and look at some videos to be sure

[Gingerfinch]

Was the Holding of 1984 better than Walsh of say the 90's? Not for me.

Ah. I wasn't factoring in the "1984" bit ... I see what you mean. Would probably have to go back and look at some videos to be sure

I'm basing it on the 84 tour to England. Holding bowled well but Walsh in the 90's was a terrific bowler, although not in the class of Ambrose or a pre injury Bishop

[alfie]

I've had a bit of a look back at the figures. Holding took 15 at 22.8 in England in '84 . Not too shabby.

And in Australia later that year 15 at 16.60...which I do recall watching. I think he still has a case , no ?

[Gingerfinch]

I've had a bit of a look back at the figures. Holding took 15 at 22.8 in England in '84 . Not too shabby.

And in Australia later that year 15 at 16.60...which I do recall watching. I think he still has a case , no ?

Yeah definitely a case. I didn't watch the Aussie tour of course but given Walsh took 519 wickets in the period and at a decent average, he gets in my team. Anyway I gave you Richie. Don't get greedy

[alfie]

I've had a bit of a look back at the figures. Holding took 15 at 22.8 in England in '84 . Not too shabby.

And in Australia later that year 15 at 16.60...which I do recall watching. I think he still has a case , no ?

Yeah definitely a case. I didn't watch the Aussie tour of course but given Walsh took 519 wickets in the period and at a decent average, he gets in my team. Anyway I gave you Richie. Don't get greedy

Actually Ritchie was Red's...though I probably wouldn't argue. OK , fair enough : you can have Walsh for this 1984 one...( I can always go back and reminisce about Gibbs Hall Kanhai Hunte and Sobers - having a year or two on you I think )

[Gingerfinch]

I've had a bit of a look back at the figures. Holding took 15 at 22.8 in England in '84 . Not too shabby.

And in Australia later that year 15 at 16.60...which I do recall watching. I think he still has a case , no ?

Yeah definitely a case. I didn't watch the Aussie tour of course but given Walsh took 519 wickets in the period and at a decent average, he gets in my team. Anyway I gave you Richie. Don't get greedy

Actually Ritchie was Red's...though I probably wouldn't argue. OK , fair enough : you can have Walsh for this 1984 one...( I can always go back and reminisce about Gibbs Hall Kanhai Hunte and Sobers - having a year or two on you I think )

I'm sure if I had watched Cricket from 1980 onwards, Roberts and Holding would be in. Who would miss out then? Walsh for sure but who else?

[sussexpob]

Not Walsh for me - great for longevity but just wasn't the same class as the others IMO. Holding was class and would be an auto pick for me and also Ian Bishop was blighted by injuries but I'd take a fully fit version ahead of Walsh

Holding had a terrible series in Australia before Packer ripped Australian cricket apart for a decade after. Averaged 60. The next two tours Windies had to Australia was against a Z team with no packer players, and then a weird hybrid tour where England and Windies played different Australia teams simultaneously, with the quality obviously devalued to the point the MCC refused to give the England games Ashes status. Australia emerged from Packer at their historical worst. Its obviously not hard to see why.... England lost 6 players to packer, and lost more in 1981 to the Rebel tour including the top test scorer of all time. The two historical powerhouse teams were in chaotic shuffle.

The only other side Holding played a test against was India, who were not on the same planet of quality to the batting side that emerged in Walsh's era... and NZ, who Holding had a rubbish record against. Had Packer not occurred, would the West Indies team been at all memorable? They got thrashed just before, and you listen to those legends talk about series like they were in NAM.

Walsh's average of 24 is worth much more than Holding's of 23....