2nd Test: India v England at Visakhapatnam on Nov 17-21,

[andy]

he wasn't feeling good Arthur..think he spent time off the field..

[Arthur Crabtree]

OK, thanks. Wondered if that was it.

[Dr Cricket]

One thing that this England spin attack needs is a spinner who can bowl 35 overs in innings with a low rpo. Also they need to flight the ball well rather than bowling just flatter trajectory.

Finally adi you give a better statement than vague statement like 3 spinners will win games.
Think you just hit why cook isn't confident with 250-300 target.
If Bangladesh can nearly chase 260 odd imagine what kohli and co can do.
Got a believe at the moment on day 4-5 a bad spinner can actually lose the game since accuracy not there and the margin of error tiny because the field attacking so many gaps for boundaries and if cook goes defensive easy singles.

Anyway we see this in action if England do set India a target later on in the series.

[Dr Cricket]

For me that sad part is England don't have a specialist spinner that they can trust and they don't trust batty really, if they did like batty, ansari wouldn't be playing and more of the journo would be talking about batty since they all see England nets.
Not sure why ball or Finn don't get dropped out of the squad especially with England probably a left arm spin option short.

[rich1uk]

thing is everyone knows england need a spinner that can bowl 30+ overs a day, tie up an end and let the other bowlers rotate at the other end, simple fact is we dont have one

its like saying if we had another top order batsman that will average 50 we will consistently score more runs

i do wonder whether the selectors are so paranoid over what happened with Kerrigan that they didn't pick someone like Leach just in case they damage his development

[Dr Cricket]

But surely rich leach or rayner better option than ansari. He adds nothing especially with his bowling can hardly bowl 10 overs an innings.

[meninblue]

One thing that this England spin attack needs is a spinner who can bowl 35 overs in innings with a low rpo. Also they need to flight the ball well rather than bowling just flatter trajectory.

Finally adi you give a better statement than vague statement like 3 spinners will win games.
Think you just hit why cook isn't confident with 250-300 target.
If Bangladesh can nearly chase 260 odd imagine what kohli and co can do.
Got a believe at the moment on day 4-5 a bad spinner can actually lose the game since accuracy not there and the margin of error tiny because the field attacking so many gaps for boundaries and if cook goes defensive easy singles.

Anyway we see this in action if England do set India a target later on in the series.

England were very close to win with same spinners. The declaration was an issue, not spin bowling.

[rich1uk]

But surely rich leach or rayner better option than ansari. He adds nothing especially with his bowling can hardly bowl 10 overs an innings.

i would have thought what i have said about Ansari already should answer that question Bhav

i would much rather have taken the chance with Rayner than Ansari even tho he is 31 now and it would kinda be on the back off one good season, even at that age if he made the leap to test cricket he would have 4 or 5 years left in him

as far as Leach is concerned, again i would have preferred to see them take the chance, but as per my above comment i wonder whether what happened to Kerrigan has made them cautious about throwing a young spinner in at the deep end

i do think there is still an element in how we select teams about being afraid players will fail rather than backing them to succeed. it was like in the run up to this test where there was a school of thought saying that anderson should replace duckett as he wasn't scoring any runs anyway, so we should just play 7 bowlers rather than back him to do what he was included in the squad for in the first place.

[rich1uk]

One thing that this England spin attack needs is a spinner who can bowl 35 overs in innings with a low rpo. Also they need to flight the ball well rather than bowling just flatter trajectory.

Finally adi you give a better statement than vague statement like 3 spinners will win games.
Think you just hit why cook isn't confident with 250-300 target.
If Bangladesh can nearly chase 260 odd imagine what kohli and co can do.
Got a believe at the moment on day 4-5 a bad spinner can actually lose the game since accuracy not there and the margin of error tiny because the field attacking so many gaps for boundaries and if cook goes defensive easy singles.

Anyway we see this in action if England do set India a target later on in the series.

England were very close to win with same spinners. The declaration was an issue, not spin bowling.

the declaration wasn't the issue

there had been zero sign whatsoever from how england were batting in their second innings that with an extra ten overs we would have won the game. its only with the benefit of hindsight and that india had a mini-collapse that the declaration is even being questioned.

no captain in the world would have declared 10 overs earlier and set the opposition a target of 250 from 60 overs in the first test of a 5 test series, on a pitch where batting was still looking pretty easy.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Stokes one of three batters to have scored more than 200 runs in the series, so doing better in Asia than expected. Pujara and Kohli the others.

Helps when Saha seems to be refusing to get him out. What is it now? Three dropped chances and a missed stumping? Got bowled off a no ball last night too......

I'm reading he wasn't out though...

[meninblue]

One thing that this England spin attack needs is a spinner who can bowl 35 overs in innings with a low rpo. Also they need to flight the ball well rather than bowling just flatter trajectory.

Finally adi you give a better statement than vague statement like 3 spinners will win games.
Think you just hit why cook isn't confident with 250-300 target.
If Bangladesh can nearly chase 260 odd imagine what kohli and co can do.
Got a believe at the moment on day 4-5 a bad spinner can actually lose the game since accuracy not there and the margin of error tiny because the field attacking so many gaps for boundaries and if cook goes defensive easy singles.

Anyway we see this in action if England do set India a target later on in the series.

England were very close to win with same spinners. The declaration was an issue, not spin bowling.

the declaration wasn't the issue

there had been zero sign whatsoever from how england were batting in their second innings that with an extra ten overs we would have won the game. its only with the benefit of hindsight and that india had a mini-collapse that the declaration is even being questioned.

no captain in the world would have declared 10 overs earlier and set the opposition a target of 250 from 60 overs in the first test of a 5 test series, on a pitch where batting was still looking pretty easy.

Well i think the extra ten overs would have not given a win to India but given more opportunities to England.


The only player who could have scored quickly waa Virat. Expecting 4 runs from others on day 5 was too much. If Sehwag was there then it was understood. But not with this lineup with struggling Gauti and cautious players like Chet and Ajinkya.

[rich1uk]

Well i think the extra ten overs would have not given a win to India but given more opportunities to England.


The only player who could have scored quickly waa Virat. Expecting 4 runs from others on day 5 was too much. If Sehwag was there then it was understood. But not with this lineup with struggling Gauti and cautious players like Chet and Ajinkya.

but we had just seen england bat for 75 overs in their second innings and only lose 3 wickets, 2 of those were after they had decided to make a push to set up the declaration and weren't "normal" batting

at the time the declaration was being considered i dont think there was any reasonable expectation that even those extra 10 overs would be enough to bowl india out, the pitch was still looking too good to bat on

so even tho it would have been unlikely that declaring earlier would have led to a loss, at the time the decision was made and without the benefit of hindsight knowing that india would be 6 down after just 42 overs, i dont think anyone can say it was a bad declaration, especially in the first test of a 5 test series

its easy to be critical with the benefit of hindsight

[Gingerfinch]

I was surprised Cook declared that early.

[Dr Cricket]

Same ginger thought he declared early and would bat out draw and just take a draw and tire the Indian bowlers.

[backfootpunch]

Difficult for the England spinners to go at less than 3rpo because of how many fielders are on the boundary

Too many easy singles on offer

From the bits iv seen and the highlights rashid seems to have bowled quite well but with not much look

His drop of kohli basically gave us no chance in this game though, when you lose the toss on this sort of pitch you can't drop the oppositions best batsmen when he's well set