Cricket-Match-Special ... A forum for discussion

braveneutral wrote:Same as they did with Monty. It can destroy a player.

Dont worry, I appreciate the bloke is one of many talent youngsters who was ate up and spat out by Flowers England. I was always a huge fan of Shehzad, but they destroyed him too. There is a sense though, and the example of Monty is a big one, that some players who react badly to that sort of treatment might confirm some of the England's self serving prophecy towards them..... if Monty hadnt got drunk and urinated on bouncers, he would probably be in the team, if Rashid had gone back 6 years ago and bowled well, he would be in the team. You cant implode in your personal life or in your on field performance and expect people to take notice.

I guess the point is, I am skeptical about picking anyone who has such a mediocre record for long, despite understanding why that might be or what qualities they exhibit in between..... in the end, is the low points evidence of a laziness to work harder, or a natural mental defeatism that will be exposed at the higher level eventually?

sussexpob wrote:

cricketfan90 wrote:

Alviro Patterson wrote:

Making_Splinters wrote:Easy win for Yorkshire in the end, great game for Lyth not so much for Cook.

Great to see Adil Rashid in amongst the wickets, giving him every chance of starting the first test.

Not really sure Rashid has done enough for selection in my own opinion, but there was always something about him.

Not sure he has it for test cricket mind, 3 of his last 4 years he has struggled to perform well enough to play Division 2 cricket, not sure one summer confirms he is a test player.

Seems typical of England to take the "but he can bat as well carrot"

I feel Rashid was included in the England squad purely because the Caribbean wickets are conducive to spin. Once Moeen returns from injury and the summer internationals commence then it's back to Yorkshire, unless if Dilly has a barnstormer.

Until they go to UAE though, where they'll pick two spinners. Or any future tour to Asia.

Don't know what to make of Monty. Mike Selvey says he's unpickable, but he can't tell anyone why. But he said the same a year ago about KP, and he was looking out of the window. So a rumour is spread through innuendo, without any certainty there is anything really the matter. Of course, whatever this thing is, he manages to play in the CC. Usually.

I am kind of along the same train of thought as AP really. A huge performance could change it but probably a stopgap? UAE a valid point though.

Not really comfortable with the term "stop gap" being used towards any player taking a debut call up to the test team. If he is the spinner in possession of a place and plays well, then he has to be continued with, and be picked as thus. At no point should people be told or picked to be in a squad other than for reasons that they deserve to be there.

The really point about Rashid, regardless, was that he didn't react well to being dropped last time, so does he have the mentality for it? As I said, the kid has clear talent, but I would have liked to see him get another year of county cricket before the plunge so its a valid pick moving forward for the future, not just a one tour "hope" pick, which I feel it is.

More bungled policy? Hopefully Rashid has matured and has the ability, because he is a mouthwatering prospect if he can replicate his form last year for England.

I think the point is that may be the case Sussex but that the ECB are quite comfortable acting in this manner. The whole squad feels like it has been done in that vain.

braveneutral wrote:I think the point is that may be the case Sussex but that the ECB are quite comfortable acting in this manner. The whole squad feels like it has been done in that vain.

As in a few punts have been made.

braveneutral wrote:I think the point is that may be the case Sussex but that the ECB are quite comfortable acting in this manner. The whole squad feels like it has been done in that vain.

Probably why in 5 years, Flower never picked a single fresh international selection that got anywhere near to being a regular player. I have gone through this many times, but this policy of selection is rotten and its long term effect is proven to have no benefit! I don't know when they will ditch the erroneous policy.

sussexpob wrote:

braveneutral wrote:I think the point is that may be the case Sussex but that the ECB are quite comfortable acting in this manner. The whole squad feels like it has been done in that vain.

Probably why in 5 years, Flower never picked a single fresh international selection that got anywhere near to being a regular player. I have gone through this many times, but this policy of selection is rotten and its long term effect is proven to have no benefit! I don't know when they will ditch the erroneous policy.

I don't think they will until they change quite a few heads at the top.

sussexpob wrote:Not really comfortable with the term "stop gap" being used towards any player taking a debut call up to the test team. If he is the spinner in possession of a place and plays well, then he has to be continued with, and be picked as thus. At no point should people be told or picked to be in a squad other than for reasons that they deserve to be there.

The really point about Rashid, regardless, was that he didn't react well to being dropped last time, so does he have the mentality for it? As I said, the kid has clear talent, but I would have liked to see him get another year of county cricket before the plunge so its a valid pick moving forward for the future, not just a one tour "hope" pick, which I feel it is.

More bungled policy? Hopefully Rashid has matured and has the ability, because he is a mouthwatering prospect if he can replicate his form last year for England.

Adil Rashid was another player who made the England limited overs squad on the back of strong County Championship performances and wasn't even a limited overs regular for Yorkshire at the time.

Strangely enough since Rashid got omitted from the England team, his stock as a limited overs cricketer rose substanitally. Taking wickets and bowling economically in all formats during 2010, which got him a Twenty20 contract for the South Australia Redbacks and was tournament leading wicket taker.

After the horror years in 2011 and 2012, Adil Rashid has come out of it a much better player. Given extra responsbility with the bat as Joe Root and Jonny Bairstow were representing England, before rediscovering his mojo with the added ability to contain the bowling, something which wasn't there in the early days.

Who knows, Adil Rashid may be as pivotal for England as Graeme Swann was.

Alviro Patterson wrote:

sussexpob wrote:Not really comfortable with the term "stop gap" being used towards any player taking a debut call up to the test team. If he is the spinner in possession of a place and plays well, then he has to be continued with, and be picked as thus. At no point should people be told or picked to be in a squad other than for reasons that they deserve to be there.

The really point about Rashid, regardless, was that he didn't react well to being dropped last time, so does he have the mentality for it? As I said, the kid has clear talent, but I would have liked to see him get another year of county cricket before the plunge so its a valid pick moving forward for the future, not just a one tour "hope" pick, which I feel it is.

More bungled policy? Hopefully Rashid has matured and has the ability, because he is a mouthwatering prospect if he can replicate his form last year for England.

Adil Rashid was another player who made the England limited overs squad on the back of strong County Championship performances and wasn't even a limited overs regular for Yorkshire at the time.

Strangely enough since Rashid got omitted from the England team, his stock as a limited overs cricketer rose substanitally. Taking wickets and bowling economically in all formats during 2010, which got him a Twenty20 contract for the South Australia Redbacks and was tournament leading wicket taker.

After the horror years in 2011 and 2012, Adil Rashid has come out of it a much better player. Given extra responsbility with the bat as Joe Root and Jonny Bairstow were representing England, before rediscovering his mojo with the added ability to contain the bowling, something which wasn't there in the early days.

Who knows, Adil Rashid may be as pivotal for England as Graeme Swann was.

If Rashid becomes a fraction of as good as Swann was we'll be doing well.

Rashid' s career is mirroring Swann' s in that both got picked for England squads prematurely,went away and reinvented themselves and came back a stronger product. Rashid impressed on the Lions tour where overtly his figures didn't look impressive,he bowled long spells on shirt fronts quite economically. He's replacing Ali in the West Indies where he'll be bowling on responsive wickets but I can't see both him and Ali in the same team routinely.

The Cricketer magazine county preview predicts the end of season tables will be:
Div 1
Yorkshire
Warwickshire
Sussex
Durham
Middlesex
Nottinghamshire
Hampshire
---
Somerset
Worcestershire

Div 2
Essex
Surrey
---
Lancashire
Kent
Derbyshire
Northamptonshire
Glamorgan
Gloucestershire
Leicestershire

Predicting the county championship is often little more than guess work, it'll be interesting to see how accurate these tables turn out to be.

westoelad wrote:Rashid' s career is mirroring Swann' s in that both got picked for England squads prematurely,went away and reinvented themselves and came back a stronger product. Rashid impressed on the Lions tour where overtly his figures didn't look impressive,he bowled long spells on shirt fronts quite economically. He's replacing Ali in the West Indies where he'll be bowling on responsive wickets but I can't see both him and Ali in the same team routinely.

Rashid's leg spin could be a key weapon in The Ashes if the Aussie quicks are bowling around the wicket, creating scuff marks for Rashid to aim at. England could decide to go with two spinners for the Cardiff test.

Alviro Patterson wrote:

westoelad wrote:Rashid' s career is mirroring Swann' s in that both got picked for England squads prematurely,went away and reinvented themselves and came back a stronger product. Rashid impressed on the Lions tour where overtly his figures didn't look impressive,he bowled long spells on shirt fronts quite economically. He's replacing Ali in the West Indies where he'll be bowling on responsive wickets but I can't see both him and Ali in the same team routinely.

Rashid's leg spin could be a key weapon in The Ashes if the Aussie quicks are bowling around the wicket, creating scuff marks for Rashid to aim at. England could decide to go with two spinners for the Cardiff test.

Sound enough in theory but far too forward thinking for the present set of selectors.