There may be troubles ahead: England selection issues.

[sussexpob]

lolz if you think A tours are less quality than county games.

From the team that England played in SL in 2014, the following could be said:-

The two openers in the SL team (Karunaratne and Tharanga) where the most potent players to face. Both barely average 30 in tests, and both have been around a long time (60 odd matches combined)
The rest of the Sri Lanka team faced have done little. Dickwalla averages 20 in tests, one bowler has a test average of 45, one played some ODI's and averages 106. And one has had one test and got two ducks.

Lets just compare that with the Surrey team of the time, simply because they had a couple of Sri Lankans in it

The first is Kumar Sangakarra...... Makes a persusaive case as being the best batsman of his generation. Averages better than all but 2 or 3 batters to have played the game. One of test crickets top ever run scores. And probably SL's best player ever, certainly their best batter.

The second is Dilshan..... Scored 40 international hundreds. Has been ranked the best ODI player in the world before, T20 legend, plus 40 average in tests.

We move on....

Kevin Pietersen - Before being retired he was on course to be England's top ever run scorer. Averages a shade under 50 in test cricket with over 20 x 100s......

Graeme Smith - South African crickets 2nd top run scorer of all time. Has 27 test hundreds and over 9000 test runs.... one of the most successful captains in Cricket history.

Hashim Amla - 25 x 100's in tests, over 7000 runs, averages 51... also captains South Africa

K O'Brien - 100 x ODIs with a plus 30 average

Jason Roy - Averages a shade under 40 in ODI's with a SR over 100

Chris Tremlett - Averages 27 per wicket in test matches

Not to mention a handful of other International Caps.... or very soon to be International Caps.

I personally know which Id rather test my youngster against.

LOLZ

[Dr Cricket]

Yeah it great by misleading the numbers by include T20 blast foreign players.

Anyway end of the day England missing out no warm up in india and no base for the lions near india so they can send a reserve in quickly enough and with some match practice under his belt.

[Dr Cricket]

Tell me if playing in this games is better than facing Leicstershire, Derbyshire etc.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/542459.html

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/542460.html

[sussexpob]

Yeah it great by misleading the numbers by include T20 blast foreign players.

Anyway end of the day England missing out no warm up in india and no base for the lions near india so they can send a reserve in quickly enough and with some match practice under his belt.

The ECB arranged for the Indian team to play three times before 2014 test series. So why is it assumed that no tour matches in India is the ECB's fault, isnt it the BCCI who need to arrange the reciprical game arrangements? So they are going to not give warm up matches on the basis the ECB arent making an effort for them, but the ECB did make an effort for them, so where is the point?

And to remove one person per team, even two per team to incredibly over state the numbers, based on T20 only players would leave over 5.2 foreign players per team. You seem to be grasping with the reality with a level of difficulty. At no stage ever was there 130 players. And that 130 number does not include in the vast majority of cases people who have qualified for English citizenship. The actual number is actually far higher when taking guys like Sam Robson into equations.

The truth is, so many Kiwi's, Saffers, Irish, Scots, Aussie, West Indians and Zimbabweans have relations with English passports due to cultural migration, there are more people from these countries combined than ever before making up county numbers.

If India's have come before, but arent coming now, its either a question of them being not good enough to get contracts, or the fact they earn to much to be attracted to it. Your list of three players earlier that tried to negate this point about IPL stopping Indians coming included one player (aaron) who never played county cricket, and two others that retired long ago.

And why would counties take on untested players? The Sri Lanka's and Windies players who justify their position will get opportunties. Someone like Fidel Edwards is a perfect example, he has a home at Hampshire as long as he is fit and available, despite his poor test record.

[sussexpob]

Tell me if playing in this games is better than facing Leicstershire, Derbyshire etc.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/542459.html

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/542460.html

Well lets review this team.... in FC average terms

Batting

Cowan - 40 Average
Davis - 30 Average
Klinger - 40 average
Forrest - 35 average
T Paine - 28 Average
Burns - 39 Average
Cooper - 33 Average

Average - 35 per player

Bowling

Lyon – 36 per wicket
Johnson 28
Holland – 38
Bird - 25

Average – 31.75

Derbys
Goldeman - 32
Wes Durston - 33
Neil Broom - 40
Shiv Tahkor - 38
Wayne Madsen - 40
Ben Slater - 28
Gary Wilson - 35

Average 35.14 per player

Bowling

Milnes – 35
Tom Taylor – 29
Tony Palladino – 30
Will Davis – 30

Average - 31



Seems like a close match, but Derbyshire on career records win

[Dr Cricket]

ECB don't want any warm up games, BCCI can't do anything if they don't want any games.

Anyway Aaron played county cricket with Durham was only allowed county championship games with Hasting only playing list A games during end august/early September.

nice that you left out Pakistan from that post, wonder when they will get opportunities.

really it isn't a big deal for teams asking for more A tours in England especially if they want similar arrangement in the winter or them having a base while an overseas tour is taking place.

[Dr Cricket]

Also think we all agreed Sri lanka are the weakest team lions could face with probably alongside Bangladesh yet in the past 6 yrs England lions mostly play both those nations a lot.

2010 Bangladesh
2011 sri lanka
2011/12 Sri lanka/Bangladesh
2013 Bangladesh
2013/14 Sri lanka
2014 Sri lanka
2015/16 Sri lanka
2016 sri lanka
2016/17 Talks again with Sri lanka.

9 times in the past 6 years, but no series With india in the last 5 yrs and only 2 series with Australia and that too was in the contract for the double Ashes deal in 2013.

[sussexpob]

ECB don't want any warm up games, BCCI can't do anything if they don't want any games.

....

nice that you left out Pakistan from that post, wonder when they will get opportunities.

1. Can you serve me with one reliable quote from an ECB source that indicates THEY rejected secheduled warm up matches. Its always been the Home team convention of arranging these, and I cant find any such articles

2. There were 9 Pakistan players in county cricket last year, see the list I posted.

[Dr Cricket]

Home team arranges the warm up games, but the touring team can and could reject them and do their own warm up games elsewhere.
See ECB press releases during the 2013/14 Ashes when their threaten the CA of going to NZ if they don't provide Strong opposition for the warm up games or the warm up games they wanted.

Anyway for this tour Andrew strauss said they had contingency plans for warm up games in india if the bangladesh tour didn't take place so I am pretty sure BCCI offered ECB warm up games but it was ECB that decided having the warm up in bangladesh would be a better idea.

You not going to find sources in the internet for this unless BCCI/ECB start leaking things to the press like they did during 2012.
pretty certain ECB rejected the warm up games since if they wanted warm up games in india they will have them, BCCI can not say no to warm up games before a tour, they can play in what ever pitches they like or have awful teams but the fact remains if ECB wants games, the home team have to provide it.

2. their was precedent in 2013/14 of ECB basically saying they going to have warm up games in another country if they feel the warm up are not good enough etc.

3 it doesn't take a genius to work out that ECB basically made the Bangladesh tour the warm up for india series.

ok the evidence is flimsy but it more likely ECB rejected the warm up then BCCI not giving any considering ECB are getting warm up games in india if the bangladesh tour is called off and the fact is the home board always has to arrange the warm up fixtures.
if it was the latter BCCI wouldn't give warm up games if bangladesh tour got cancelled, if they didn't want to give them before why would take change they mind if bangladesh tour got cancelled.


All I have to say it is surprising Struass is making these decision considering he liked warm up games even if the standard or pitches are poor, even in 2012 when the pitches were flat or green with limited spinners england still won 2-1 and if anything those warm up games were crucial with the batsman getting time in the middle and the spinners bowling overs that got them prepared for the pace and length for the wickets and they essentially outbatted india and outbowled india.
doubt England would have won without the warm up games.

[sussexpob]

Rather a long post, but can we just sum it up more quickly as saying.... "No evidence, this is complete guess work"

[Dr Cricket]

Rather a long post, but can we just sum it up more quickly as saying.... "No evidence, this is complete guess work"

What your reason behind England not having any warm up games in india.

[sussexpob]

Rather a long post, but can we just sum it up more quickly as saying.... "No evidence, this is complete guess work"

What your reason behind England not having any warm up games in india.

Could be anything. I wouldnt know.... but neither do you, so repeatedly banging on about the ECB for failures we dont even know are their causing is pointless.

It could equally be the BCCI failing to arrange one. It could be relative schedules of the teams making it hard. Could be anything.

[sussexpob]

Probably worth noting that I believe the 2008 series had no warm up provided, something that the ECB were very vocal about. After the Mumbai attacks England went home, then went to the UAE for a training camp, before the last minute decision to play. So they hardly got a chance that time round. In 2011 they were pretty upset with the rubbish opposition given and the scheduling of the venues.

So its not like you can sit here and say "oh the is ECB this and that" without any evidence. Its hardly like the BCCI have been doing nothing but provide the best for their opponents, so how you can make a giant leap of faith to think they were happy to provide it this time is beyond me

[Alviro Patterson]

Also think we all agreed Sri lanka are the weakest team lions could face with probably alongside Bangladesh yet in the past 6 yrs England lions mostly play both those nations a lot.

2010 Bangladesh
2011 sri lanka
2011/12 Sri lanka/Bangladesh
2013 Bangladesh
2013/14 Sri lanka
2014 Sri lanka
2015/16 Sri lanka
2016 sri lanka
2016/17 Talks again with Sri lanka.

9 times in the past 6 years, but no series With india in the last 5 yrs and only 2 series with Australia and that too was in the contract for the double Ashes deal in 2013.

Forgot to add India in 2010, Australia in 2012 + 2012-13, South Africa 2013-14, New Zealand 2014, Pakistan 2015-16 + 2016

[Alviro Patterson]

lolz if you think A tours are less quality than county games.

Expanding on SP's point on what players Surrey have fielded, a County Championship fixture between Yorkshire and Surrey this year.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/c ... 46835.html

Surrey
Current Internationals: Roy,
Former Internationals: Sangakarra, Rampaul, Davies, Batty*
Lions material: T.Curran, Foakes

Yorkshire
Current Internationals: Root, Bairstow, Willey, Plunkett, Rashid
Former Internationals: Lyth, Bresnan, Ballance*
Lions material: Brooks, Lees

* Ballance and Batty got England call-ups later this year

So in answer to the above, County Championship matches can be of a higher quality than an International "A" game. In fact this particular game was close to test match standard (having personally attended Day 1&2)