Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Making_Splinters » Wed Jan 28, 2015 9:10 pm

bhaveshgor wrote:For a start ECB/sky needs to remove the ridiculous media restrictions so Ireland can actually get games against other nations barring Eng/Aus/Pak and probably Sri lanka.

Afghanistan will probably get games against pak/Sri lanka and they will always get asia cup every 2 years.

to make it fair ICC should make WI, Pak, Ban, Zim, Afg and Ireland play similar amount of games otherwise it will be impossible for Ireland/Afg to get an automatic spot.


Cricket Ireland is completely seperate to the ECB, so I am interested as to what this media deal mentioned is.
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Dr Cricket » Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:56 am

http://www.espncricinfo.com/india/conte ... 04267.html
basically Sky/ECB hold Ireland tv home rights basically Sky doesn't show/broadcast any Ireland homes games apart from England games and one australia games which was a washout but generally they never broadcast or provided tv footage for Ireland vs pak/sri lanka games.

Basically Ireland can't find ways of broadcasting their games on TV because of the ECB/Sky deal and this is no BS story people that follow associate cricket and have spoken to ireland cricket people have said that yes the Sky/ECB deal does make it so much difficult to attract other teams since team's broadcasters can't show the ireland games without Sky/ECB approval and Sky have ever been interested in Showing non Ireland/Scotland vs England games.

Under the terms of the ECB's deal with Cricket Ireland for 2008-13, it gained ownership of media rights for all Ireland's home international matches. In return, Cricket Ireland receives an annual fee, the chance to play in some of England one-day competitions should it so wish and coaching support.


ESPNcricinfo has learned that the ECB then refused to sanction the matches in any circumstances because it was concerned that its lucrative broadcasting deal with Sky TV, which guarantees exclusive TV coverage of cricket in England, Ireland and Scotland, could be undermined in the long term by the alternative attraction of an IPL side playing in Ireland. The Sky deal underpins the survival of first-class cricket in England.

The ECB holds the broadcast rights for both Ireland and Scotland and used its right of veto over televised fixtures in those countries to


Any games in Ireland/Scotland that want to be televised on TV need permission from Sky/ECB.
Ireland can show the games but only on the internet no TV coverage allowed unless Sky/ECB produces it or allows other companies to show it.
the biggest prove is that none of pakistan vs Ireland games have been televised and I can guarantee you 2-3 pak/asian broadcasters would have wanted to show the game, before the Sky deal Ireland attracted India/SA tri series before 07 tour, Scotland had one India vs pak game and other game and the reason was because Indian broadcasters were allowed to show the game and the fact rights were so much cheaper than normal india games.
http://www.itsonlycricket.com/entry/447/

Afghanistan are probably lucky they have no restriction in place to show games since both teams would find it more difficult to play games/find fixture but Afg got the advantage right now of being in Asia and having asia cup every 2 years and because of geo politics and generally Sri lanka playing pak/Ban quite a bit you can probably add Afg into the list.

Afghanistan should have regular fixtures against Pak, Sri lanka so they should play far more games than Ireland.
Ireland only played 11 games in 2011 and 2015 against other full members.
Afghanistan already played 10 games in the last 12 months (forgot Zimbabwe)
Ireland have never really had a meaningful fixture list apart from 1 or 2 games each year where as Afghanistan were getting 5-6 games each year against full members.



Edit sorry for swearing.

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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Making_Splinters » Thu Jan 29, 2015 7:32 am

bhaveshgor wrote:http://www.espncricinfo.com/india/content/story/604267.html
basically Sky/ECB hold Ireland tv home rights basically Sky doesn't show/broadcast any Ireland homes games apart from England games and one australia games which was a washout but generally they never broadcast or provided tv footage for Ireland vs pak/sri lanka games.

Basically Ireland can't find ways of broadcasting their games on TV because of the ECB/Sky deal and this is no BS story people that follow associate cricket and have spoken to ireland cricket people have said that yes the Sky/ECB deal does make it so much difficult to attract other teams since team's broadcasters can't show the ireland games without Sky/ECB approval and Sky have ever been interested in Showing non Ireland/Scotland vs England games.

Under the terms of the ECB's deal with Cricket Ireland for 2008-13, it gained ownership of media rights for all Ireland's home international matches. In return, Cricket Ireland receives an annual fee, the chance to play in some of England one-day competitions should it so wish and coaching support.


ESPNcricinfo has learned that the ECB then refused to sanction the matches in any circumstances because it was concerned that its lucrative broadcasting deal with Sky TV, which guarantees exclusive TV coverage of cricket in England, Ireland and Scotland, could be undermined in the long term by the alternative attraction of an IPL side playing in Ireland. The Sky deal underpins the survival of first-class cricket in England.

The ECB holds the broadcast rights for both Ireland and Scotland and used its right of veto over televised fixtures in those countries to


Any games in Ireland/Scotland that want to be televised on TV need permission from Sky/ECB.
Ireland can show the games but only on the internet no TV coverage allowed unless Sky/ECB produces it or allows other companies to show it.
the biggest prove is that none of pakistan vs Ireland games have been televised and I can guarantee you 2-3 pak/asian broadcasters would have wanted to show the game, before the Sky deal Ireland attracted India/SA tri series before 07 tour, Scotland had one India vs pak game and other game and the reason was because Indian broadcasters were allowed to show the game and the fact rights were so much cheaper than normal india games.
http://www.itsonlycricket.com/entry/447/

Afghanistan are probably lucky they have no restriction in place to show games since both teams would find it more difficult to play games/find fixture but Afg got the advantage right now of being in Asia and having asia cup every 2 years and because of geo politics and generally Sri lanka playing pak/Ban quite a bit you can probably add Afg into the list.

Afghanistan should have regular fixtures against Pak, Sri lanka so they should play far more games than Ireland.
Ireland only played 11 games in 2011 and 2015 against other full members.
Afghanistan already played 10 games in the last 12 months (forgot Zimbabwe)
Ireland have never really had a meaningful fixture list apart from 1 or 2 games each year where as Afghanistan were getting 5-6 games each year against full members.



Edit sorry for swearing.


Ireland get an annual lump sum, given how small Irish cricket is, it's hard to imagine they'd do better than that on their own. Furthermore, given Ireland has no first class structure, the opportunity to play regular domestic cricket can hardly be looked down on.

Untill Ireland start developing and improving their own players, for my money they should zip it. Irish cricket is only of a high standard because their players play in the English game. Take that away and they'd be right down the rankings pretty promptly to be honest.

Aside from matches against IPL sides, do you have any information about the ECB preventing Ireland from playing international games?
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby GarlicJam » Thu Jan 29, 2015 10:19 am

How is Irish Cricket supposed to grow unless it can get the national side's games to the masses (not the Sunday ones....)? The youth of Ireland have a chance at seeing their team, they are more likely to think about taking up cricket themselves.

Your line, MS, about Irish cricket only being strong because the get to play in the English game can also be turned around - the English pinch the best Irish players which weakens the Irish national side.
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby rich1uk » Thu Jan 29, 2015 10:25 am

GarlicJam wrote:How is Irish Cricket supposed to grow unless it can get the national side's games to the masses (not the Sunday ones....)? The youth of Ireland have a chance at seeing their team, they are more likely to think about taking up cricket themselves.

Your line, MS, about Irish cricket only being strong because the get to play in the English game can also be turned around - the English pinch the best Irish players which weakens the Irish national side.


but they wouldn't be playing at that standard if they weren't getting developed by the counties in the first place

cant expect the county system to be responsible for developing players for England and Ireland , that's why its a requirement for a test playing nation to have its own first class structure

edit : just to add, irish players also get a special dispensation to not be counted as overseas players by counties , if Ireland were to get test status and that changed then how would irish cricket do with players unable to play in county cricket unless they were taken on as an overseas professional, they wouldn't qualify as a kolpak whilst still being an active international
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby rich1uk » Thu Jan 29, 2015 2:51 pm

you know how I said the other day I disliked the new layouts on cricinfo , I like it even less now they have applied it to the whole site

its terrible to try and navigate around
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Dr Cricket » Thu Jan 29, 2015 3:13 pm

People that have cover Associate cricket have said this happen.
https://twitter.com/andrewnixon79/with_replies
https://twitter.com/QTV_Sports

Either way i am not getting into if it is right or wrong since Ireland themselves said it is a good thing since they get guaranteed income but don't really want the irish team to take part in the english cricket system which is why the old pro 40 didn't have ireland in it and their also said their want to play more nations.

People that follow associate cricket have said Ireland lost out on game because they can't guarantee tv coverage because of the Sky/ECB Deal.

TBH the proof is there that Ireland have played so few games compared to Afghanistan and they have only had ODI status for 2-3 years.

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/archi ... 25557.html

Confirmation from Cricket Ireland :-

Saj

no television coverage of the games. Sky Sports own the rights but have declined not to show the games given clash with England v Sri Lanka Test


PS I will say this again this no BS story Ireland have lost games because of the tv rights situation.
All I said was if Ireland want to qualify they need more games and Sky/ECB needs to start covering games their have rights to not sure how ireland getting less odi games is linked to them getting more money/allowed in the first class structure by ECB.
Not sure why Ireland can't do both IE play more ODI and still get money/Cricketing help from ECB.

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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Dr Cricket » Thu Jan 29, 2015 3:14 pm

Making splinters Ireland does have their own First class cricket structure now.

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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Dr Cricket » Thu Jan 29, 2015 3:25 pm

rich1uk wrote:you know how I said the other day I disliked the new layouts on cricinfo , I like it even less now they have applied it to the whole site

its terrible to try and navigate around


yeah so terrible didn't mind the old one since you could still see stories in the home page but now it is impossible to find stories.
mind have to use Cricbuzz where a friend of mines is an editor and many people in this forum knows him.

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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Dr Cricket » Thu Jan 29, 2015 3:42 pm

Nice Cricinfo had the prove I wanted all along.
before the rights ireland played more than twice the number of games and after rights the number of games dropped and most of the full member games were against England.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci-icc/cont ... 24893.html

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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby idlebrain » Thu Jan 29, 2015 4:42 pm

Nice article in Cricinfo on the recent Supreme Court (India) judgement against BCCI (Mr. Srinivsasan's ownership of CSK etc)

http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/co ... 24373.html
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Making_Splinters » Thu Jan 29, 2015 7:05 pm

bhaveshgor wrote:Making splinters Ireland does have their own First class cricket structure now.


When their national side is born out of it rather than underwriten by English counties then I'll changemy stance. Without the English domestic structure Ireland would be on oar with Scotland.
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Alviro Patterson » Thu Jan 29, 2015 7:42 pm

When Ireland's rise to claim occured in the 2007 World Cup, 4 players of the 15 man squad consisted of ex-pats (Johnston, Botha, Bray, Langford-Smith) and another 5 consisted of players plying their trade in County Cricket (Rankin at Derbyshire, Niall O'Brien at Northants, Eoin Morgan at Middlesex, Andrew White at Northants, Porterfield played 2nd XI cricket between 2004-2006).

Whilst Cricket in Ireland is better managed than even some test nations, they are nowhere near strong enough to go independent just yet. Ireland's First Class competition of 3 teams playing four 3-day matches hardly compares to the test nations equivalent. TV money is not everything and there is no reason why Ireland can't arrange full ODIs against test nations visiting England or are twiddling their thumbs.
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Making_Splinters » Thu Jan 29, 2015 7:49 pm

GarlicJam wrote:How is Irish Cricket supposed to grow unless it can get the national side's games to the masses (not the Sunday ones....)? The youth of Ireland have a chance at seeing their team, they are more likely to think about taking up cricket themselves.

Your line, MS, about Irish cricket only being strong because the get to play in the English game can also be turned around - the English pinch the best Irish players which weakens the Irish national side.


England don't "pinch" anyone. Irish cricket and Irish players are only anywhere near decent because they are bankrolled by the coaching, medical and exposure to English cricket. The highest profile Irish player is Morgan, who can't get a sniff at the Test side these days.

Take the sob stories elsewhere. When Irish cricket is funded, developed and supported by Irish cricket they can have a leg to stand on.
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Re: Random Cricket Thread (International Cricket)

Postby Dr Cricket » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:38 pm

Alviro Patterson wrote:When Ireland's rise to claim occured in the 2007 World Cup, 4 players of the 15 man squad consisted of ex-pats (Johnston, Botha, Bray, Langford-Smith) and another 5 consisted of players plying their trade in County Cricket (Rankin at Derbyshire, Niall O'Brien at Northants, Eoin Morgan at Middlesex, Andrew White at Northants, Porterfield played 2nd XI cricket between 2004-2006).

Whilst Cricket in Ireland is better managed than even some test nations, they are nowhere near strong enough to go independent just yet. Ireland's First Class competition of 3 teams playing four 3-day matches hardly compares to the test nations equivalent. TV money is not everything and there is no reason why Ireland can't arrange full ODIs against test nations visiting England or are twiddling their thumbs.

That the point Ireland can't do that because teams won't play because Sky/ECB won't televise the games their have rights to.
Ireland have tried many times to get team to come over or teams that tour england to visit ireland and the tv issue is been a big hurdle.

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